Sheet music for the advanced tunes

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This topic contains 18 replies, has 7 voices, and was last updated by  Dana 2 years, 9 months ago.

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  • #5500

    bond61
    Participant

    Is there sheet music that you can give us with the advanced videos that will have notations with the trills and hammer on’s and slides, etc. that are already marked for us? That would definitely be a plus and easier to follow.

  • #5501

    Roland White
    Moderator

    Hi Bond61, Roland Forum Moderator here. That is a good question that I’m sure Casey can answer for you. In the meantime I can tell you that I have discovered that transcriptions can by tricky and sometimes very difficult to interpret. It has also been said that they are often not as exactly the player played it. I’ve found that developing that skill requires some very careful listening. If you don’t already have one get the Amazing Slowdowner by:
    http://www.ronimusic.com/ Check it out you can slow it down enough to get a closer listen and that really helps interpreting the tunes. Thanks for Posting. Good luck and check back in with us.

    • This reply was modified 3 years, 1 month ago by  Roland White.
    • #5504

      Casey Willis
      Keymaster

      Roland – You beat me to the punch by literally 4 minutes!!

  • #5503

    Casey Willis
    Keymaster

    Thanks for the question, Bond61. A couple of thoughts on sheet music for the advanced melody:

    Each time through the performance/advanced version of the tunes, the teacher may play a lick differently…or bow it differently. Basically, the teacher might play a section four (or more) different ways…Which way should that section be written in an advanced transcription?? It left us the choice of either (1) writing really complex, long versions of the tune … or (2) just providing the basic melody as a frame upon which to lay the advanced licks.

    and,

    No matter how well transcribed, sheet music for the advanced melodies could never capture the feel or groove which is taught during the video lessons. In a sense, we are hoping that you will learn these tunes and licks by ear (by watching the video tutorials). The sheet music is provided because we recognize that learning solely by ear does not work for everybody, and that sheet music can be a useful tool.

    My personal take on sheet music is that whether a transcription is basic or super-complex, it can sometimes give you unnecessary boundaries as a player; YOU should determine when to put that cool triplet run or grace note and not simply play it the Nth time through the tune because the sheet music is written that way…

    My bet is that if you are a player who learned primarily via sheet music and subsequently train yourself to play by ear, you will find yourself much more able to improvise over new tunes.

    All that said, I totally understand that it would be really helpful to have individual licks written out. We may revisit writing sheet music for the advanced version in the future, if there are enough requests. But that would probably mean we’d have to go learn how to write out all those funky grace notes and licks!!!

    That clarify for you? Motivating or depressing?? (hoping the former)

  • #5505

    bond61
    Participant

    Thanks for clarifying this. What you explained makes perfect sense. I actually play Piano and Guitar also. I’ve been learning the violin for a little more than a year now. I can read music but if you were to take the music away from me I’m almost like a beginner. I’m just now after years of playing piano, and guitar, learning how to improvise and play by ear. It is fun to put in those trills and slides and hammer on’s where I think it sounds good.

    • #5508

      Casey Willis
      Keymaster

      That’s awesome, Bond61. I’m excited for you, as you start experimenting with improv/placing multiple licks in specific places. I do some fishing as well, and I compare learning/playing music by ear instead of by sheet music to switching from drift/bait fishing to fly fishing…it is frustrating as all heck when you start, and it’s like you’re a beginner again…then you hook that first fish (or land that first improved lick).

      Things that come easily are not as rewarding, right? Gook luck, sir. Keep us posted!

  • #6580

    Anonymous

    I totally see that it is time consuming, but I would also like some further notation, especially some of the more important bowings. Can you show us how to notate things like flicks, wiggles and waterfalls correctly? Right now I’m using a check mark, curly-cue, and a squiggle… Lol. But, I would prefer to do it correctly.

    • #6589

      Casey Willis
      Keymaster

      Hi, Blossom. I’ll check in with Hanneke and Kevin to see if they have any tips to provide on writing these kinds of ornamentation out. Thanks!

  • #6627

    Roland White
    Moderator

    Hi, Bondi, Blossom and Casey, its nice to see this discussion thread because all of us that play folk music strive to include the accents of a particular style without it sounding like its been rehearsed a million times…. Right?…. I would resonate Casey’s remarks that as your accomplishments on your instrument grow so do your choices on how to play your tunes. The ability to randomly and spontaneously add the trills, ornaments, flicks, cuts, rolls, or bow tricks only come with countless hours of listening, observing and practicing. So don’t give up but try to get some practice in on the ornaments playing them correctly very slowly until they become easy enough to start adding them into your tunes. I personally love how the Irish Fiddlers change up where they use grace notes as they meander there way through the tune, so it is always a pleasant surprise to hear different settings of the same tune from other players to get ideas on how the grace notes can be interchanged to make a creative rendition of the tune. Have fun and keep watching the FV teachers and you will be adding more accents to your tunes the more you play.

  • #6630

    Dana
    Participant

    Ah, I emailed Casey just this morning on this topic! I wasn’t sure where to put slurs in part B of Swallow Tail.

    This kind of “figuring it out” varies a bit from the lessons I get from my in-person teacher. With her I’m learning the classical style, all from books, which show ornamentation gradually as we go.

    I’ll watch, listen, and play Swallow Tail again to see if I can work out the slurs and bowings in part B.

    • #6631

      Casey Willis
      Keymaster

      Just saw your email and figured I’d reply here, Dana…

      I think that sounds like a great approach. I bet you can likely pull the bowing from the instructional video. Just remember that I may play it a couple of different ways…pick one that works for you and practice, practice, practice!!!

    • #6795

      Roland White
      Moderator

      Hi Dana, Roland White Forum Moderator. I missed your post on learning slurs in your playing Swallow Tail and I’m assuming its the Jig, not the Reel. I always suggest to students and players to get on YouTube to hear what different players do with the tune and see what works for my ear and ability for new ideas. I also suggest learning separate from the tunes the actual ornaments of the style. This will give you the freedom to choose when and when not to ornament. Our Master Fiddler Kevin Burke is my favorite Irish Fiddler as he always tastefully uses ornaments and often times will not, to show the real beauty of the tune. Thanks for chiming in on FV forum and check back again and let us know how you’re doing.

  • #6888

    GreenFiddler
    Participant

    One thing about the music is – ultimately you don’t play from it of course – but there are several stages of learning. The sheet music is for the stage between learning the “bare tune” notes and the polished/totally memorized stage of the advanced tune.

    As a learning tool, the memory reminder for the advanced version is a great time saver. We play with you on the video tutorials, but the next day, or busy people that we are, sometimes even a week or so later, I may not remember every single option or alternative “lick.” That means going thru the entire tutorial video again (Yes, the videos aren’t that long, but 6-10 minutes is more time than glancing at the sheet music and going “oh yes, that one” and then turning away from the music to play it). Which is why if you won’t offer the sheet music for advanced versions, having the ABC format will help – then I can write it down more easily for myself – and create my own version. (I’ve actually already started it for Kevin Burke’s songs – you can get ABC versions off of thesession.org.).

    – Shannon

  • #6892

    Casey Willis
    Keymaster

    Would it help if I posted the Finale .mus file? I bet you could convert it to ABC…I don’t have any experience in doing so. Just let me know.

  • #6905

    ulla_petersen
    Participant

    Perhaps better if you could export it as MusicXML; this is a general format that can be read by many programs, including the excellent, free music notation program “MuseScore”, and DAWs such as “Cubase”, which I happen to use 🙂

    • #6910

      Casey Willis
      Keymaster

      Hi, Ulla. It looks like that format is an option for Finale, the program I use to create sheet music. At this point, I’m not in a position to export all sheet music and embed them in each lesson…however, I’ll be happy to email files to any member who wishes for select sheet music files. Post your requests here, or just email the contact email address with the song(s) you wish, and I’ll be happy to send them along.

      Thanks!!

  • #6929

    GreenFiddler
    Participant

    Thanks Casey!

    Any possibility of a PDF? Here’s instructions on how: http://www.finalemusic.com/UserManuals/Finale2012Win/Content/Finale/Adobe_PDF_documents1.htm

    I would love for Limerock and I don’t love nobody, whatever format 🙂

    Thank you, Casey!

  • #6931

    Casey Willis
    Keymaster

    Sounds good, Shannon. I’ll email you MusicXML files in the next few days.

  • #6933

    Dana
    Participant

    Thank you, Roland!

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